SOG PATCHES

(If you have a patch worn or designed while in SOG and would like to have it posted, send a photo copy of it to Robert L. Noe.  Provide a little history on the patch. Thanks.

(All patches depicted herein are not to scale to prevent duplication)

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Naval Advisory Detachment Danang, Vietnam a MACV-SOG The symbols inside the mast indicated USN and USMC, the Mask indicated secrecy, and the sword indicated death to the enemy.     Naval Advisory Detachment Danang, Vietnam conducted covert operations using PTF’s  (Patrol Torpedo Fast The "Nasty Class" Fighting Boat).-Robert Tucker (“Tuck”), RMCS USN (Ret.)

FirstFlight.jpg (203427 bytes)

 In 1964, SOG had six modified C-123s known as the First Flight Detachment for agent and supply drops in support of Op 33 and 34. (Plaster 2000, 71). All aircraft were flown without any identifying markings linking them to the US. Additionally, these aircraft "were flown by Chinese air force pilots from Taiwan, who rotated regularly in and out of Vietnam" (Plaster 1991, 295). Pic furnished by Sam Hamilton

SOGPatchsm.jpg (126072 bytes)I picked up in 1971-72 while I served with "SOG's air arm, First Flight." I was the Logistics Officer. The Commander, Lt Col Rose, and I were the last two officers in Nha Trang when we closed the unit. Of course we didn't wear the SOG patch or a unit patch. Sam Hamilton image002.png (92887 bytes).

Richard Lewis Cox SSgt E6, 5th SF, SOG Attachment, Kontum, VN, CCC and CCN, RT Arkansas) was the one zero of Recon Team Arkansas for a tour. Patch furnished by his brother Philip Cox.

A somewhat rare patch. I created in on 1970, and only bought enough (one each) for the existing team members (US & SCU). Prior to this patch, RT NY had no patch, as i recall, making us the only team at CCC without one. I have seen some poorly done replicas, which were likely fabricated by mama-san, for successive team members.

Interesting to note: my SCU had no idea what the cloaked figure on the.patch represented. And the language barrier prevented me from explaining the concept. Subsequently, they wanted a tiger, but there were already a couple of patches like that for other teams. I had initially toyed with using a vampire as the central figure, but then I discovered what the Vietnamese version of a vampire was; it was either too disgusting, or laughable, for consideration.

Ed Wolcoff

 
For comments on SOG Patches, click--> Comments
 

This is the first Recon Team pocket patch. We had 40 of them made in Danang in December 1965, as a protest against some of the leadership we were stuck with. It seems that most officers were more concerned on constructing the bar, latrine and roofing their quarters then training the newly assembled recon teams. The patch, starting at the top: RT= Recon Team, the dark cloud and rain signified Kham Duc. P.D. could either stand for “political disgrace” or “Prima Donna”. We were always reminded that if we didn’t like it, we could be sent back to Oki in political disgrace and were always referred to (not to our face) as “Prima Donnas”. Why not? We were the only soldiers out of many assigned, that went on operations. The pick&shovel were our main weapons during this period. The beer can: The officers, who at times would attempt to supervise the various projects, would always have a can of beer in their hand. 118 stood for one pick one shovel eight hours a day. Did we wear these patches? Just for a few days to send a message.

This practice came to a halt when Colonel Simons got wind of it. By the way, the latrine at Kham Duc that we named the “Roman Bath”, was designed and constructed by two old airborne engineers, Dick Warren and Ernie Tabata.

Woody Woodworth, RT Ohio

Woody,

And I remember when Major Drunk-All-The- accused us of thinking we were "Prima Donna's", & you said "you're dammed right, & if you want to be one, the next time I'm assigned a mission, you're welcome to draw a Swedish-K 7 VC rucksack & come along with me." I don't think he ever took you up on it.
Frank, RT Dakota.
Nil Carburundum Illegitimis

Analysis of info and conclusion. There were SOG patches worn, it seems at FOB 2 by non-operational (Recon/Hatchet) members on their uniforms. The patch was worn by Recon/Hatchet members on non uniform garments. The uniform, cammie, shown was not an item worn by members of SOG, or at least no one recalls them. To view comments from the field on this patch, click--->The responses from those who served

SOG PATCH COMMENTS

From:  idahonezero@msn.com
The only patch we wore was the MACV/SOG patch, but never a C&C Patch (CCN, CCC, CCS). Some of us had team patches sown in our berets but not these .. that I remember.

Tilt Meyers

From: batman@frontiernet.net

Capt. Bob:

On or about mid July '68 someone brought one of those patches to our hootch. Whoever it was said that the REMF's had designed and ordered these patches for everyone (meaning us) to wear as pocket patches. 

After examining the patch closely we decided that it was one of the funniest things we had ever seen, what with the skull, blood running down from it's fangs,eyes with red slits, etc., and decided that if asked/ordered to wear such a "macho" abomination on our overwise sterile fatigues we would refuse. To the best of my knowledge and belief this never came to pass.  Also, again to the best of my knowledge and belief, this was the first and only time I ever saw one of those patches until I ran across one on ebay.

IT IS A STRANGE WORLD WE LIVE OLD FRIEND.

De oppresso liber

Batman sends.

From: Shane5th SFG

He may have sewn it on later on in life to wear to SF meetings or gatherings.  Shane sends...............

From: pmartin@adelphia.net

I seen them on the same uniform, but only worn on the FOB II base. I was not on the actual base that much and always on flight status so I was afraid to wear mine.

After all I was told that if I ever talk about this place or the patch I'd be tossed so far behind bars I would have my spaghetti and meatballs fed to me by slingshot.

From: SFAHQ

ROBERT

If you have the book "SF The First Fifty Years" look on page 285.  If you don't, on that page at the very top is MACV SOG Pocket patches, & inside-beret patches, and the one you sent is called a inside-beret patch. 
DE Oppresso Liber

Burrel Wilson
Special Forces Association


From: john.newman@innovene.com

I saw them worn around FOB 2 when I was there in 70/71. Seldom by RECON. Team  members usually wore their team patch and/or the SCU patch.Ditto Hatchet Force. Support personnel wore them in lieu of team patches. Sorry. This is the best I can do after 30+ years! 

From: brokenhippie@centurytel.net

You are absolutely right Bob.  I never knew it to be worn on the pocket.  However it wouldn't surprise me if someone sewn on the patch on the pocket as a thing after they got out of the service, like many do up north here, when they go hunting.  I still have mind sewn on the inside of one of my berets, and have it sewn on my outdoor wear.

From: DILIGAF2U@webtv.net

Not at Phu Bai 69-70 as I recall, Maybe on the uniform in camp at
DaNang, Recon ---don't think so.

Ray


From: Alright4u

Robert: This is not a jungle fatigue, not indig, not tigers, nor the rare all black. Beats the shit out of me.

I recall the SCU pocket patches were issued at Omega within a week or so of when I was given command of second company. That was mid August 68 to September 68. The reason I recall the timeframe was we got M-16's for yards in the HF's then.

Jon


To:
Bud Burrell

I never saw one worn on the pocket at CCN, primarily because there was already an NVA 40,000 piaster ($400 US) bounty on a green beret with head attached!

Larry
--
Larry Richardson
Jonoe'da' chautauqua (Elk River)
(4th generation Seneca Iroquoise)


From: james.acre@knology.net

Robert:At CCS there were a lot of SOG patches and team patches but nobody ever wore them that I recall.Ernie Acre

From: ccsdoc@direcway.com

I never saw one until looked in the cavalry store in KY, they were selling them for all three cc detachments



Doc Quackenbush



From: CSMMULCAHY

If my fading memory serves me.That patch, although sewn into the Beret by some was also worn on the pocket of some wantobes around Kontom in the '69/70's.  Inside the Beret was the excepted way to display it. The Mike Force displayed our patch on the pocket, and perhaps that prompted others to do the same.

Mulcahy sends
4th Bn Mile Force
Kontom

From: Ettingersk

When I was there the SOG patch was worn on the pocket (Left) and the Recon Team patch on the pocket (Right side)

Skip


From: sharpccoraj@lvnworth.com

At CCS we wore the SCU (Special Commando Unit) patch on our pockets.  I can’t recall seeing this one, the few times I was at Kontum.  We didn’t wear the camies (looks like rip stop) at that time.  It was Jungle Fatigues (OG 107’s-I think), indig fatigues, or tigers.  That was 68/69.  I didn’t start seeing the camies until around 70 with the Marines on Okinawa.     aj

From: Shandriana

SOme guy's wore them on their uniform on the compound.  I had a black uniform with a CCC patch on it.  I can't remember if I ever wore it outside the compound.  I had a dragon in my beret.

                   jimbo,   Jim Jones-Shorten (CCC, 1970-71)


From: Nicksog

I never saw one at Sigma, period.  The only place I ever saw one worn as a pocket patch was in the last season of the TV series Tour of Duty.  After I stopped fuming, I just laughed my butt off at the silliness of Hollywood.  I think the last thing we would have wanted to advertise was our involvement in SOG.

From: WolfGarry

Robert....when I was there from June 1966 to June 1967, no such patch was worn by anyone - US or local - at FOB-1 nor (I didn't see any US or Yards) at FOB-2. So, the patch was created after that period. Ask Frank Jaks since he spent several tours with SOG. Good luck Wolf

From: sunnyuno@verizon.net

I did not receive the photo for some reason.  Seems we wore a patch circa 70 on the left breast pocket of a tiger and parachute.  I have one and a
photo I think showing it being on the uniform that way.  Not sure if it was legal or not.  I do remember I think it was one guy at Recon Co. at CCN
wearing a SOG patch that was going to go downtown and someone else telling him to take it off.  Our hootches in CCN all had the plaque and name of
each team clearly displayed above the doors.  I figure they did it that way in case the sappers ever got into CCN again so they could like pick the
teams they really wanted to wax! Dumb in retrospect! George


From: rick@grabianowski.com

Robert,
        It appears to me that the uniform is a light weight BDU.  I do not recall ever having a camouflaged uniform at CCN.  We wore the OD "jungle fatigues", which were usually spray painted with black paint before going on the ground.  This was until the end of 1970.  Perhaps later they did issue this BDU.  But then again, the first BDU's were "heavy weight" ones.  Of course CRS could be affecting my memory.
Rick

From: RustyLang

We were still running the same at CCN in '71.  Sterile OD green jungle fatigues shadowed with flat black spray paint, and with black electrical tape around the leggings (I suppose we didn't have any duct tape available).

 
I think the tiger fatigues were all used up in the late 60's, and I believe that the CAMMO jungle fatigues the person wears in your photo weren't issued until AFTER the war. 
 
I'm not sure of the date, but the CAMMO jungle fatigues with the CCC patch are historically incongruent because CCC's name was changed to TF2AE in March/April '71 when the 5th Group colors were returned to Ft. Bragg.  I was at CCN / TF1AE until late September '71 and we always wore the same OD greens with black paint. 
 
From March/April '71 on, all the SOGgies were told to start wearing black baseball caps in garrison instead of our berets.  I was a bit rebellious, and decided to go without a cover for the rest of my tour.  The only person who ever called me on it was Billy W.

I never saw anybody wearing SOG pocket patches at CCN in '71, however, I noticed that one or two of the South Vietnamese working on the CCN compound were wearing LLDB pocket patches. 

 
The SOG patches became popular after the war, and I found some at an Army Surplus store in the late 80's.  The first time I saw the SOG emblem used in a Hollywood movie was on a tee-shirt worn by a young teenage wannabe-vampire-killer in the comic teen scream movie, The Lost Boys.
 
Sincerely,
 
Rusty
 
Bruce Rusty Lang, MD     Rusty's short war story
Project 404, Laos, 1970
CCN, One-Zero RT Mississippi, 1971   

From: batman@frontiernet.net

Capt. Bob:

On or about mid July '68 someone brought one of those patches to our hootch. Whoever it was said that the REMF's had designed and ordered these patches for everyone (meaning us) to wear as pocket patches. 

After examining the patch closely we decided that it was one of the funniest things we had ever seen, what with the skull, blood running down from it's fangs,eyes with red slits, etc., and decided that if asked/ordered to wear such a "macho" abomination on our overwise sterile fatigues we would refuse. To the best of my knowledge and belief this never came to pass.  Also, again to the best of my knowledge and belief, this was the first and only time I ever saw one of those patches until I ran across one on ebay.

IT IS A STRANGE WORLD WE LIVE OLD FRIEND.

De oppresso liber

Batman sends.

From: dougmccready@juno.com

I never saw one on a uniform pocket and the uniform in question looks
very much like the lightweight BDUs hanging in my closet that are the
current  Army uniform. One of the other guys who's also still in may be
able to confirm my BDU response.

Doug McCready
1940-GL

Support Guys Comments:


From: tbennie01@yahoo.com

Hey Robert, Tom Bennie here, I was with the 170thAHC,1970  and I remember the patch, I think it was worn on the uniform.

From: croc-6@cox.net

I don't recall ever seeing the patch worn on a pocket, Robert.

Don

From: Crashmakool
To: SOG1RLNOE



Hey Robert,   You know this is funny because a few years ago I got in the same conversation with a Comanchero door gunner who had a patch that looked very similar to the one shown except it said CCN.  I told him I had never seen one like that and where did it originate?  It was very old and definitely from Nam. He said that a mamasan at Camp Eagle used to sew them up.  I have two CCN patches, one given to me says MLT-2, and an FOB patch.  All are the blue crest shape with the gold star burst and the crossed rifles. The gunner went home maybe 4 to 6 six months before me. About the end of 70'

I just dug out my U.S. SPECIAL FORCES SHOULDER & POCKET INSIGNIA GUIDE #3 BOOK and on page 248 it shows one exactly as the photo you have. It says  CCC pocket patch (Viet) - a red and gold burst with black center, gray V, black bar with gold CCC, white skull with black detail and red eyes, green beret with white bordered yellow and red flash.  85mm X 115mm.   (ME)  (stands for machine embroidered)

note: Some patches are identified as jacket patches (usually where we wore them) normally large size items, however many of these from VN era were actually meant to be worn inside the beret.


                                                                              Crash Reports

Subj: Re: SOG Pocket Patch
Date: 10/19/05 2:06:08 PM Central Daylight Time
From: EPJDDS

Never saw it at CCC during 1969-70. I had mine sewn on my helmet bag. It was on many wind breakers but never on fatigues.

Pete Johnston
SPAF-4