Note 1: Information on this website is copyrighted and may not be used for any purpose without the expressed written permission of Robert L. Noe, Webmaster.  This website contains up to date information pertaining to those Killed and Missing In Action as of  FEB 3 2023.

Note 2: It has been proven in a US Court that no Nerve Gas was ever used by SOG in a lawsuit against CNN

Note 3: Contra to wikipedia and some other sources MARINE FORCE RECONNAISSANCE was not, I repeat not an element of the Studies and Observation  Group (SOG)!  They did not become part of the Special Operations Command until after the Vietnam War!

Note 3: On the day of my arrival in Vietnam, December 21, 1969, there were 28 soldiers Killed in Action and on November 1st, 1967, the date of my brother's death in Vietnam, there were 40 Americans lost.

It's official. I hate your damned web site. Every time I go to your web site
I wind up reading your shit. Then I read a link & read some more good shit. Damn. I hate your web site because I can't turn away from it easily. Thanks for all of your work on it. Long after we're dead and gone folks will be going to it, or at least our kids might. TGIF, Brother. Tilt
-RT Idaho from 68 thru 70. (John Stryker Meyers)

MACV-SOG (Military Assistance Command , Vietnam Studies and Observation Group). MACV-SOG was a joint service high command unconventional warfare task force engaged in highly classified operations throughout Southeast Asia . The 5th Special Forces channeled personnel into MACV-SOG (although it was not a Special Forces group) through Special Operations Augmentation (SOA), which provided their "cover" while under secret orders to MACV-SOG. The teams performed deep penetration missions of strategic reconnaissance and interdiction which were called, depending on the time frame, "Shining Brass"or "Prairie Fire" missions. For every insertion that was detected and stopped, dozens of other commando teams safely slipped past NVA lines to strike a wide range of targets and collect vital information. The number of MACV-SOG missions conducted with Special Forces reconnaissance teams into Laos and Cambodia was 452 in 1969. It was the most sustained American campaign of raiding, sabotage and intelligence gathering waged on foreign soil in U.S. military history. MACV-SOG's teams earned a global reputation as one of the most combat effective deep-penetration forces ever raised. The missions were assigned were exceedingly dangerous and of strategic importance. The men who were put into such situations knew the chances of their recovery if captured was slim to none. [Taken from]

MACVSOG accepted Special Forces qualified men who volunteered only with the exception of a very, very fewm who demonstrated the skill and attributes required and were in country alread.... the bravest of the brave volunteered. Don't ever forget the air assets who has balls of steel who risks everything to get us in and out! - Robert Noe

MSgt Roy Benavidez, USA Medal of Honor. Life-size bronze bust by Jenelia Armstrong Byrd with Valor Remembered Foundation




Sir, I was looking at some of the MIA info of one of "my" team leaders (Jerry "Mad Dog" Shriver) this afternoon and came across the SOG website.  I haven't taken the time to go through everything yet but trust I will.  I was one of those aviators that supported the SOG operations.  I was a 20 yr old aircraft commander with the 119th AHC slick driver.  We flew out of FOB II
 staging mostly from Dak To.  I flew inserts, extracts, string extracts, deception inserts, virtually everything needed to keep the missions going. I learned so much from my short 120 assignment with SOG.  I later flew with
 the 57th Assault Helicopter Company (based in Kontum), that had the honor of
 being the dedicated helicopter support unit for FOB II.  I have tried to practice what I learned about courage, loyalty, faith, honor, selflessness,
 keeping your word to your comrades though it could mean your own life, and the willingness to do whatever is necessary to do the job.  I have tried to
 instill these traits in my children.  I am humbled to this day by what I saw each and every day of my assignment there.
     Your comments about us drivers and our crews are appreciated.  I for one know however that yours was the far greater hazard and sacrifice.  I have
 always been proud of the work I did in RVN.  In 2 tours I logged more than 3000 hours combat time.  In each of my tours my best moments were always when I was getting the guys out of the sh..., or bringing in some mail and maybe a beer.  Compared to you and every regular grunt who humped a ruck in
 the bush I was just another REMF.  God Bless, lets get our POW's, MIA's, and
 our fallen brothers back.  My flight school roomie, Chuck  Osterman was shot
 down and killed (after hostilities ended) as part of the program to bring our dead home.  I have numerous aviator friends who are among the missing and presumed dead, too many.  I for one want a full accounting. Thanks for helping keep the fight for accountability going on, Respectfully,
 Richard C. Olson
 CW-4, USA Retired
 Nov 1965 - Jun 1987
 RVN 2/67 - 3/68
 RVN 11/70 - 11/71

The above pic was at a Washington, DC protest against protesters, 2009





Military Assistance Command Vietnam - Studies and Observation Group


You have never lived until you have almost died. For those who have fought for it,
life has a special flavor the protected will never know.

(My Zippo had a SOG crest on one side and the above words on the reverse side -- the only difference was that in place of the five words in have underlined above was: "FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR"-Lewis Arnoldt, CCS '70 - '71

MACV-SOG (Military Assistance Command, Vietnam - Studies and Observation Group) was an unconventional warfare task force engaged in highly classified operations throughout Southeast Asia. The U.S. Army's Special Forces (Green Berets), Air Force Combat Controllers, Navy SEALs and other units channeled personnel into MACV-SOG through Special Operations Augmentation (SOA), which provided their "cover" while under secret orders to MACV-SOG. The teams performed deep penetration missions of strategic reconnaissance and interdiction which were called, depending on the time frame, "Shining Brass" or "Prairie Fire" missions.

We hit USASOC Hq and it tore my heart out to stand at the wall for Special Ops Soldiers and see so many names that you and I knew first hand as friends. I made a suggestion to Tilt that at the next SOA it might be stunning to have a blown up photo of this wall prominently displayed. I know that most all of us have never seen this memorial, as it is behind some security. I'm attaching a couple of photos for you to see, one is a photo from a distance of the memory wall, and another is a concrete plaque that SOA donated. You may have seen these already. You might zoom in on the individual and you can see some of our heroes that you knew.

Thanks, Mike 

DSCF0356.jpg (1603119 bytes) DSCF0357.jpg (1381688 bytes) DSCF0359.jpg (1371714 bytes)


Bob Noe is a good friend of mine, who I met when stationed at Fort Polk, LA.  A few months ago I passed him some photos of the Green Beret
exhibit on display in the JFK Presidential Library in Boston, MA.  I took these photos when I was vacationing there this past summer (2004). Greg Metzgar

Please E-Mail Robert Noe (CCN 69-70) for any information. Click "here" to send email.

Young man, young man, what do you wannabe?

Wanna grow up and sit around and drink beers with FOGs and call the Green Beret a "beanie"?  It's easy. Be ready to do 50 pushups in a row. Then 20 chinups without a break. Before you start. Chug 20 miles with serious rucksack on your young bod. Now, enlist in the US Army (preferably Airborne Ranger option). Get a set of genuine paratroop wings affixed to your chest first. A Ranger Tab will help, too.  Do a few years and earn a few stripes with the 82nd Airborne Division, the Rangers, one-oh-worst, whatever. Prove your mettle in the conventional military first. Then go to SFQ. You've now had a few years to decide where you're going to fit best; weapons, commo, medic, or engineer. This is where you start.  BTW, re-enlist at this point.  Then pass the SFQ and spend a couple of years on an operational team. You will get to know them as well as your own family. The eleven of them will know you this well, too. Be prepared ('cause this is what you're gonna do) to face down the 99th Mongol Horde Regiment in the pitched black of a jungle/desert night when the weather's bad, there ain't no air support, accompanied by two other Americans and leading 100 totally terrified local natives. If this is what you really want to do with your life, enlist now. Otherwise, respect the men who did this to protect your freedoms. (Note, don't remember who sent this to me)

Warning Notice: If you are not Special Forces Qualified, have not served with Special Forces, did not serve with SOG, don't claim this status as you will be exposed in our website's "PHONY WANNABE'S Hall of Shame."--We consider you as  the lowest scumbags on earth, a thief stealing the valor of others. Your families and friends will be shocked and ashamed when they discover your deception. In the past number of years, I have had to tell many wives, children, grandchildren, other relatives, and friends of the fraudulent status of these individuals, some at the time of their deaths or thereafter! What a legacy of shame to leave them.RLNoe

''We held the line. We stopped the falling of the dominoes,'' ... ''It's not that we lost the war militarily. The fact is, we as a nation did not make good our commitment to the South Vietnamese.''  See Anti-War's Unintended Consequences  William C. Westmoreland, 1985 @ 173rd Abn Bde Anniversary and VIETNAM WAR INTERVIEW, COL BUI TIN, COL, NVA & THE ANTIWAR MOVEMENT  

HOW THE VIETNAM WAR WAS WON THEN LOST:  The Democrats took over the congress and turned their backs on our ally and the 58 thousand lives lost as well as the thousands and thousands of wounded. They just got tired of Vietnam and sided with the Anti-war crowed and gave away a victory which was won. Thousands and thousands of lives were lost in Vietnam and Cambodia because of their act. I was serving with the 1st Special Forces Group on Okinawa during this period and we were all sick of what Congress had done. All I can say is that if anyone ever counts on America as a friend, don't be surprised and don't count on her to support you, even if you have it in writing, if the Democrats come to power, they will sell you down the drain... An act they are capable of, as proven by history. America is my country and I love her, but the truth is what it is.  RLN \

(copy and paste the url the search engine to view the video:


"The Vietnam Redux At last, General Giap has published his memoirs and confirmed what most Americans knew. The Vietnam war was not lost in Vietnam -- it was lost at home. It exposes the enormous power of a biased media to cut out the heart and will of the American public.General Giap was a brilliant, highly respected leader of the North Vietnam military.The following quote is from his memoirs currently found in the Vietnam war memorial in Hanoi: "What we still don't understand is why you Americans stopped the bombing of Hanoi. You had us on the ropes. If you had pressed us a little harder, just for another day or two, we were ready to surrender! It was the same at the battles of TET. You defeated us! We knew it, and we thought you knew it. But we were elated to notice your media were definitely helping us. They were causing more disruption in America than we could in the battlefields. We were ready to surrender. You had won!"


You know, I am constantly reminded of how "worthless" SF troops are.  Starting with General Abrams and his pack at MACV.  As an Air Force E-6 in MACSOG in 1972, I was aware of the following: 

  1. The numbers, location and strength of each NVA division in South Vietnam
  2. What that unit's actual designation was in the NVA
  3. Names and ranks of the major commanders
  4. When that division left North Vietnam, approximately how much they lost in the movement south and where they staged prior to entering South Vietnam
  5. How many and type of tanks they had
  6. When they planned to attack (April 1, 1972)

 All of this information had been collected mainly by those "worthless" SF recon teams at CCN, CCC and CCS.  Well any way, it must have been worthless, because General Abrams and his "Staff" choose to entirely ignore it. I remember the day the attack started and they said, "Oh my, where did all of these people and equipment come from"  We are totally surprised.  My ASS!!!  Thank God for U.S. Army Special Forces and if I ever have to go to war again, please Lord let me be surrounded by them.

Don Williams, SMSgt, USAF Retired' MACVSOG 60, April 24, 2008

This is the Prayer of the U.S. Army's Special Forces.  This image containing the prayer was printed on the back of the 5th Special Forces Group's 1999 Christmas Formal program-CLICK ON THE PICTURE FOR ENLARGEMENT

"Whoever does not have the stomach for this fight.  Let him depart.  Give him money to speed his departure, since we wish not to die in this man's company.  Who ever lives past today and comes home safely will rouse himself every year on this day.  Show his neighbor his scars and tell embellished stories of all their great feats of battle.  These stories will teach his son, and from this day until the end of the world, we shall be remembered, we few, we band of brothers for whoever has shed his blood with me shall be my brother, and those men afraid to go will think themselves, lesser men as they hear of how we fought and died together.."
Shakespeare, "Henry V"

Dr. Peter G. Bourne who spent three months "observing" a Special Forces A-Team in the RVN

Here is a link to The Article.


The findings in this study are in sharp contrast to the observations made by Harris on combat troops in the Korean conflict. We found little evidence of the "buddy system" which he described, nor did we observe in our subjects' significant emotional dependence on the social fabric around them. External threats have traditionally been considered a prime factor in producing cohesion and closeness in a group. However, among the members of this Special Forces "A" team acceptance of the dependent role in the group was so alien to their self-image that the danger that drove them together also stimulated forces that tended to push them apart.

These differences appear to be attributable to the unique personalities of those who choose this way of life. For the average infantry soldier, often a draftee, combat represents merely a dangerous threat to his welfare, and he will seek any available form of physical and emotional support to enhance his survival. By contrast, the Special Forces soldier has come to incorporate his ability to survive in combat as part of his normal adaptation and as a significant aspect of his self-realization. He seeks exposure to danger with an almost addictive fervor in order to reconfirm his faith in his own ability to overcome it. For him, it is not merely to survive but how often and how independently it is accomplished.

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This site was last updated 09/30/23